Re^5: Modernizing the Postmodern Language?

Again, they said that no strict and no warnings are still possible.

Reverting the new defaults is possible for v7, but they explicitly said it would not necessarily be true for v8. If Perl resumes its pre-5 version pace, that's only a few years away. Even if reverting the defaults remains possible, the programs where strict and warnings are least convenient are 5-line throw-away programs run in implicit -n or -p loops, where turning them off or saying use vars qw// is just getting in the way for no benefit. For one-liners, it could mean the difference between using Perl and not bothering. I claim (and don't appear to be alone, looking at p5p), the better tradeoff is to put use v7 in a file and get all the new defaults. I already use use v5.20 or whatever in my longer scripts, so it seems totally natural, but I guess according to Sawyer almost nobody does this.

Re-watching the p7 talk now, again, I really don't like how certain patterns are labelled "bad." The Perl I know does not get overly opinionated on how I write things. These talks bother me enough to crawl out of the woodwork and ask the Monks if I'm wrong to be concerned. Maybe I am wrong.

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Re^6: Modernizing the Postmodern Language? by LanX (Saint) on Jun 30, 2020 at 17:19 UTC
I don't think that the details are fixed yet, they will be discussed. And yes, when using the debugger as repl I wouldn't need or want strictures. But I see the need among teams to be able to enforce an opinionated Perl. (I kept calling this the `use anal` pragma till I had the idea to Google for "anal perl" ;) My favored approach is to have "master" pragmas for different use cases. And like I already said, my gut feeling tells me that something like `use v7` will be the first solution, if only because they don't have that much time for fancier but riskier approaches. Cheers Rolf _{(addicted to the Perl Programming Language :) Wikisyntax for the Monastery}	[reply] [d/l] [select]
Re^7: Modernizing the Postmodern Language? by WaywardCode (Sexton) on Jun 30, 2020 at 20:26 UTC
Yes, I like the idea of master use-based pragmas, which could even be adjusted per version. In an alternate timeline, it would be cool if they had kept the feature-bundle separate from the anality-level. Something like: `use v5.32 :style qw/module bnf-grammar/;` ... (where 'module' style might imply strict, warnings, no-indirect, etc. and bnf-grammar implies 'guac perl') ... would not offend me at all.	[reply] [d/l]
Re^8: Modernizing the Postmodern Language? by LanX (Saint) on Jun 30, 2020 at 21:02 UTC
Yes but beginners need a simple way to have a simple Perl for fast entry and least surprise. And I don't mind if "simple" is taken as "dumb". Hence `use v7` Easy things easy and complicated things possible. Cheers Rolf _{(addicted to the Perl Programming Language :) Wikisyntax for the Monastery} PS I love here docs btw.	[reply] [d/l]


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